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Parasite's Suggestion Thread of Suggestions

#1
Housing:

Currently the state of housing is this:
1) No custom houses (great!)
2) No house looting (Not great but I am okay with this)
3) Gyspy Wagons exit (boo this house)
4) No AOE damage in houses (boo)

So my thoughts on this really are that Gypsy wagons are inherently grief homes. What I mean by this is that gypsy wagons have 1 main draw: They fit where other houses don’t. The downside of that feature is that it will be used to fit in guild towns to grief, it will be put into spots near pvp hotspots to grief, it will be put into spots to block off areas. I think this house is a bad idea and I view it to how cheesy tents were on OSI. The wagons are even worst than tents because…

No AOE in houses means pvpers can fight from houses without any real penalties. Good luck doing 100 damage to someone that only has to move a single tile. The counter to this is generally two points: A) AOE is used for housekilling/griefing and B) stop pvping near houses. For point A, I agree! Make AOE damage apply only to people in combat or PKs. Problem solved! For point B, Good luck doing that when you can slap a 5x8 gypsywagon right in between people’s buttcheeks.

So my suggestions for housing:
1) Delete gypsy wagons or make the placement area larger. Even 7x8 would be a massive improvement
2) Don’t allow gypsy wagons to hold vendors. I’ve tested placement around moongates etc and there are definitely ways to fit these where houses were not intended.
3) Allow AOE damage if criminal/combat/murderer.

Stealing/Thieving

I played a thief on OSI from 1996 to 1999 on Atlantic in the Trinsic Borrowers. I’m not advocating that we need t2a style stealing but just that stealing just seems so much an afterthought compared to the huge and sweeping changes done to almost every other skill. Right now stealing has some huge drawbacks that make even bank thieves worthless to play. I feel like I would rather just have taste ID or some other skill than ever consider stealing here.

Currently my issues with stealing and snooping are:
1) 5 minute timer after resurrection. No other skill has a timer like this that I am aware of and while I guess the intent is to stop bank thieves it isn’t like someone will REALLY make a bank thief here because
2) You get spotted doing everything even at GM snoop/steal. So you have about a 20% chance to be spotted stealing at any given time but then you also need to snoop so you have a chance (could not find formula for this) which means you basically just get spotted constantly.
3) Everything feels newbied or will be shortly after launch after everyone blesses runebooks etc.
4) You can’t steal weapons that are disarmed so good luck doing anything but bank thieving.

My suggestion for thieving is simple:

1) Allow disarmed weapons to be stolen but the same hands free restrictions would remain.
2) Allow players in a disguise kit to have a slightly better success chance or SOMETHING. Right now there doesn’t appear to be any reason to join the thieves guild.
3) Similar to how guildmates or allied guilds can’t spot stealing.. right now I think faction allies do see snoop attempts but I am not 100% on that. I might have just been unlucky. It’d be nice to use stealing during faction play.

Purple Potions

Purple potions are so bad here that it isn’t worth the regs to make them honestly. It just seems odd to put effort into making alchemy viable in pvp but then remove any offensive use that alchemy might have. Right now they work in the following way:

1) Even if thrown at the last possible moment they drop and give the target time to simply walk away. Even on foot this is easily avoided. Why bother with alchemy in PvP when you will never get extra purple potion damage? Sure you get slightly better heals but honestly it is probably better to put those skill points toward damage. Even if you target yourself while being chased you will never hit your opponent on horseback. Even if you target the furthest possible tile while being chased on horseback you will not likely hit your opponent. It is worthless.
2) They do not start auto attack. If you open a fight with a purple potion and it explodes on your target you will not auto attack them. You still have to manually attack them.
3) Similar to 1) it does not seem to trigger auto attack in the target either or seems to vary.

So to summarize all the discord discussion I will posit the following for pre ren style pvp on OSI as a behavior yardstick:

A) Purples worked on OSI and most people used them to reveal hidden players.
B) Purples DID HEATSEEK but most people could not do this targeting due to a combination of lag (14.4 and 28.8 modems) and the fact that assist programs did not have timers to combine with last target. I will note that I personally used purple potions on my dexer easily but I did have cable internet in 1998.

With the above information in mind and with the problematic assistant/macro timers not being addressable. My suggestion for purple potions is:

1) Consider slightly extending the timer. I think if you throw at ~3.85 (judging for lag..) it seems as good as you can get currently. If this was even .25 or .35 longer it would mean you could at least toss it a few tiles and hit someone near you.
2) At least make it cause auto attack for both attacker and defender, ffs.
3) Maybe even keep the damage the SAME but have the splash area be 1 tile more for GM Alchemy? That would help in PvM as well...

Corpse Creek

Corpse Creek is BY FAR my favorite part of the map. The whole area is beautifully done and allows for some great running fights but it could really use some small improvements:

1) There should be a message when entering corpse creek to warn people they are freely attackable.
2) There are a few areas I have posted in the discord map bugs area that make it really hard to move freely around the bridges and behind buildings.
3) I personally would love for corpse creek to be non mounted pvp because the very narrow bridges and chokes make horse pvp really obnoxious to deal with because you can constantly LOS around corners and some areas are only 1 or 2 squares wide. I ran around the town on foot and it was a much better experience (in my opinion at least)



Shelter Island

Not sure what the plan for this town is post launch but I would like to see the following:

1) Only young players can access the bank. Otherwise this place is where everyone will do banking and idling.
2) Stam loss free zone at least in the dungeon. Good luck pushing through people at 10 dex on launch day.
3) I’d actually like to just not allow non young players to idle there period.
 
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#4
Gypsy wagons need to cost at least 300-500k for them to be even remotely balanced IMO. I've done the UO real estate thing for long enough to know that if they remain at their current tooltip price, then Outlands will look like Eastern Europe soon after launch.

I'm mostly OK with Shelter Island being a place for general idling, though I don't think the town should offer any protections once a player has lost young status. Shelter Island being a point of entry for new players, it's not entirely a bad thing for the town to remain active. +1 for the no stam loss.

You're probably unlikely to change many peoples mind on purple potions though. For whatever reason, this server seems to vehemently reject them.
 
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#5
You bring up some interesting points on gypsie wagons, maybe instead of having to nerf them later on if they prove to be obnoxious and annoying people who bought them... raise their starting price at launch to feel them out.

I'd like to see the thief class be more than just about stealing... maybe give them a backstab ability or give them a base +2 damage or a % proc ability, so thieves wielding daggers is a thing.

As far as alchemy. Consider it already is a very in demand merchant skill.. so making it as OP as inscribe might make it overly OP.. in addition while enhanced purple pots might not in themselves be OP. It turns into a fun factor/gameplay theme factor of if players really want throwing potions to be a central theme/dynamics in pvp. I personally don't think it would add to the "funness" of pvp. But I acknowledge it's subjective.
 
#6
I thought they already confirmed the wagons would be more expensive out of the gate to avoid griefing real estate with them?

Stealing should be deleted. Purple pots didn't heatseek.

Owen confirmed it's only niche players wanting mountless combat. Also, I think he said (or maybe Luthius) that non-Young players won't be able to use the bank in Shelter Island to discourage mini-Trammel.
 
#7
I thought they already confirmed the wagons would be more expensive out of the gate to avoid griefing real estate with them?

Stealing should be deleted. Purple pots didn't heatseek.

Owen confirmed it's only niche players wanting mountless combat. Also, I think he said (or maybe Luthius) that non-Young players won't be able to use the bank in Shelter Island to discourage mini-Trammel.
Even if you walk wagons back after launch what are you going to do besides make them more expensive? I'm certain people will pay $300k to ruin someone's day.

I'm not even asking for heatseeking. I want to be able to manually time the pots for someone who is far or close. I'm totally okay with them being target ground only if that means I can actually use them in some situations rather than the current purely decorative use.

Corpse Creek is a niche town though. It's basically designed for pvpers, right? Mountless seems like a good fit to me
 
#9
I don't care deeply about mounted -vs- unmounted, but would maybe suggest that since the map is dynamic that at some point Owyn makes a new open pvp island (grey area like corpse creek) but the whole island is mountless. It'd give an overworld area to pvp in without the space or spawn limitations of dungeons without confusing anyone as much as having mountless areas on the mainland.
 
#10
Here are my thoughts on the OP:

Housing:
I agree on the gypsy wagons being too small causes issues, the problem is some of the map was designed to only hold gypsy housing in key vendor spots. I like the idea of having these sort of vendor spots being small, but the wagons fitting in un-intended spaces could cause problems.
I am not sure what all rules are in place to avoid house hiding durring PVP but that was always a turn off back in the day, I like the idea of allowing AoE to grey in order to give you a way to finish someone who is trying to house hide while engaged in PvP, but leave it off for blue, so people can have a safe haven in their house when not engaged in pvp.

Stealing:
I think there is value in a theif with the current implementation. My testing indicated that you could steal from a player, and then if they attack you then you can kill them with impunity. That alone makes stealing a fine PvP skill (steal regs/bandaids, get someone to agro you, kill em). I dont see a need to add extra bonuses for stealing.

Purple pots:
I disagree with almost everything you say about purples, I would argue that purples should deal damage in PvP based on the users alchemy skill, something like 15*(1*Alchemy) damage. As in 0 damage with no alchemy, and a small enough amount of damage that its a reasonable skill to have, but not required (if they deal the typical amount of damage but only alchemists can use em then I think alchemy would be too strong).
The usual implementation of purples makes them just 'Free' Damage (in that you dont have to have any skill tied to it), which I think should not be allowed. (although cure/heal pots are basicaly free too, but keeping yourself alive vs making someone dead are very different actions)

Corpse Creek:
I like the idea of having a dedicated mount free zone with no spawn and would be for this change.
 
#11
Stealing:
I think there is value in a theif with the current implementation. My testing indicated that you could steal from a player, and then if they attack you then you can kill them with impunity. That alone makes stealing a fine PvP skill (steal regs/bandaids, get someone to agro you, kill em). I dont see a need to add extra bonuses for stealing.

Purple pots:
I disagree with almost everything you say about purples, I would argue that purples should deal damage in PvP based on the users alchemy skill, something like 15*(1*Alchemy) damage. As in 0 damage with no alchemy, and a small enough amount of damage that its a reasonable skill to have, but not required (if they deal the typical amount of damage but only alchemists can use em then I think alchemy would be too strong).
The usual implementation of purples makes them just 'Free' Damage (in that you dont have to have any skill tied to it), which I think should not be allowed. (although cure/heal pots are basicaly free too, but keeping yourself alive vs making someone dead are very different actions)
I've tried thieving here and yes you can steal from people but it makes almost no sense other than an annoyance value. If provoking people is a goal it is easier to attack a friend/flag criminal and run into town. I didn't see the value there at all. It'd be nice to see a PvM reason to have a thief. Maybe something simple like being able to steal more than 10 stones at a time or enhanced steal ability from mobs if done from hiding/stealth? Or you get two attempts against a mob if you come from hiding/stealth? I dunno. It just isn't really useful here.

Purple pots: I'd be fine with purples doing zero damage in pvp unless you have alchemy provided there is a better way to target them. Right now even if they did 30+ damage there is no way to use them. Give it a shot against any player and you will likely hit maybe 2 out of 100 purple pots because even manual targeting is not workable. You can literally throw it as far in front of you as possible and not be able to hit someone chasing you. They have been effectively removed from the game and I am just trying to have a USE for them that is not abusable. I'm open to changes but so far the staff does not seem open to any purple potion suggestions.
 
#12
I imagine they just haven't found a solution they like for purple pots (or just the time to implement) and have chosen to leave them out of the equation (which i find preferable to having them in their current state). but yes ,my suggestion was only provide a way to throw pots reliably if they are balanced first.

Stealing in pvp is more than an annoyance. being stripped of something like a specific reg, or aids is basically a death sentence in most situations. As far as making stealing a skill that interacts with non-players (PvM, or NPC) whats the point, just kill the monster or whatever if you want their loot. I guess having 'Rares' stealable like they do in the official shards is something, but is not that interesting of a gameplay option IMHO.
 
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#13
I can agree that gypsy wagons could be a bit more expensive (not 300k but maybe 100k). Also rename them to something else, rather than use the word "gypsy".